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Author Topic: LED string saber evolution - this might change the way we think about LED string  (Read 18201 times)

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Offline Obi_1

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Price for 100x5mm led is 3$, so much cheaper but i agree 17$ is not that high but 2x17$ for maybe somthing that could be useless, it could be throwing money!

That why i m really interested in feedback to laybe try it myself

17$ for 1m of the 144LED/m type is insanely cheap!!! In Europe I cannot find an offer below 40EUR.
But as mentioned above, 100 LED for 3$ is a lot of time wasted, they are crap. The LED string blades I built have LED's costing at least 40cents/LED. And they are xxx bright.

Anyway, for sure this is a new technology and therefore costly. I will not quote the mantra that "hey, lightsaber building is a costly hobby", because I hate it myself when thrown in my face, I can only say that electronics prizes go down fast, in 1-2 years max you can have these stripes for an affordable price. For now, if you want to have it, you have to pay for the R&D.

Offline Wolf69

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Its all a matter of comparison, beacause of i can avoid the construction of a led string with these the cost would save me a lot of time!
Like you said i was taking about the R&D price.

In you opinion, is this brighter than a normal led string?

What 5mm led do you use? Any links?

And finally how do you control the color? Can a NB or a naigon osundboard can do it since they have rgb control?

Offline erv

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And finally how do you control the color? Can a NB or a naigon osundboard can do it since they have rgb control?

no, not as it is. Color and blade behavior is all digital and requires a totally new programming and system to drive such a strip.

Offline livebyhonor

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yea even though they are technically a  string blade its a totaly different architecture so even a LS board would do nothing to a neo pixel string. may have the power to run it for a bit bit not the needed programming. and i think you would need 3 or 4 meters in a saber blade anyway. in a triangle formation or square to give all around color. and if 1 meter runs about 5A. wow. 20 A for a 4 sided blade.

Offline erv

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Correct. I had to put 2 cells in // in my tron disc and it's "only" 196 LEDs on which I even had to tune the color down to avoid tripping the PCB, even if using quality cells.
IMO the strip design as it is with 5050 leds is a waste of time as the form factor of the led itself goes against what we need for a blade. Reason why I've experimented with other LEDs. I might spend the time to assemble an armpit buddies like blade with them and see if I can get a uniform blade.
I have everything on hands except free time  :cheesy:

Offline EXAR KUN

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Correct. I had to put 2 cells in // in my tron disc and it's "only" 196 LEDs on which I even had to tune the color down to avoid tripping the PCB, even if using quality cells.
IMO the strip design as it is with 5050 leds is a waste of time as the form factor of the led itself goes against what we need for a blade. Reason why I've experimented with other LEDs. I might spend the time to assemble an armpit buddies like blade with them and see if I can get a uniform blade.
I have everything on hands except free time  :cheesy:

Let me know what method to wire up the blade I'll make you a blade using the 5mm LEDs shown above and send it to you to test



Offline erv

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very kind offer :-)
I currently have like 200 of the 8mm ones that I could use eventually but I'll be in touch once I have a LS board on hands (soon, promised)

Offline Obi_1

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yea even though they are technically a  string blade its a totaly different architecture so even a LS board would do nothing to a neo pixel string. may have the power to run it for a bit bit not the needed programming. and i think you would need 3 or 4 meters in a saber blade anyway. in a triangle formation or square to give all around color. and if 1 meter runs about 5A. wow. 20 A for a 4 sided blade.

With all due respect I think you guys got a (large) bit carried away. 4m? 20A? Now please let me steer this discussion back to a realistic common ground.
I talk about 2 stripes back-to-back, with 144LED/m. A 32" blade is ~8-cm. Not 1m. And 32" is quite long, I prefer 30". So worst (best) case we talk about 160cm of LED string -> 230 LEDs, if all LEDs are driven fully, you 13.8A. Huge, but a very unrealistic scenario. I count with 20mA/LED static, that gives me ~4.5A.
Actually when it comes to LED density, I would wish something between 144 and 60 (the 2 types you can find easily on ebay), say 90L/m. Since this technology is pretty new, I guess over the years we will see a whole bunch of densities.

But for sure for those of us who enjoy building their own LED string from single LEDs, a neopixel blade with armpitbuddies design is definitely a worthy challenge. I will first experiment with the stripes, but since I also count to "those of us", sooner or later I will also end up armbuddiing single neopixs :)

Offline TheBaconWizard

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 Guys, you CAN get through-hole neopixels (a specific adafruit  brand addressable LED)

NeoPixel Diffused 8mm Through-Hole LED - 5 Pack ID: 1734 - .95 : Adafruit

These ones are 8mm and diffused: I'm not sure how the diffusion will affect the results. Less to diffuse in the blade, I guess.

They also come in 5mm, but I think too much of the package is taken-up with the driver to leave a dark spot, whereas in the 8mm it isn't so noticeable.

So basically, you need as many LEDs as would normally go in a string blade, or less.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2016, 01:54:38 AM by TheBaconWizard »

Offline erv

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Guys, you CAN get through-hole neopixels (a specific adafruit  brand addressable LED)
/quote]

as already discussed above.

Offline neskweek

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Hello there !

Protonerd did convert me with his nice video too.
I just ordered 2m of those 144LED/m (1m cost :around 17$ => IP30 ones - we don't care about waterproofing :p)
2 stripes back to back should be quite enough with proper diffusing.

As for power I planned 2x18650 cells (~2200 mA each).

If I can get at least 30 min of play time with that blade I will be more than happy.

I have to wait 3 week until delivery tho ...
I'll make a video anyway.


As for standalone NeoPixel LEDs, something to consider is they are really expensive ones (around 100 leds for a blade => 500$ T_T). 10x more than a stripe ! That's quite too much to "maybe" address diffusion problem, at least to my eyes.

[edit]
I was tired and didn't saw they sell those as a 5pack. :P so around 100$ blade using 100 through-hole LED;) That's reasonable then.

« Last Edit: March 05, 2016, 02:39:42 PM by neskweek »

Offline TheBaconWizard

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DUDE, this is why I posted just above..   a single string/strip as sold by Adafruit is fine for prototyping, but if you want to build a stringblade that's good, then you don't need to do ANY of that with multiple strings.

Just use through-hole ones in the usual way. Much cheaper, much more even, much easier to drive and control. Probably brighter with some work (flatten the ends by sanding)

Offline Obi_1

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I hope they will offer some with clear dome, diffused LEDs are dull, well, they have to, because they are not designed with lightsabers in mind, but applications where they should signal something to people looking at them with the naked eye. Not something I recommend doing with the LEDs we usually use in this hobby for LED string blades...

I'm just thinking about how to do the armpit trick with 4 leads...GND and VCC are OK, but data-in and data-out must go diagonally to the next stage. But I fully trust the imagination of this community.

BTW, I tried today the 144LED/m type in a transwhite TCSS blade, it looks very even for me even without any additional diffusing, I definitely do not see the single LEDs like with the 60LED/m type. It's very promising.

Hey, I also would welcome smaller modules like what we use for PLI with the same technology. There definitely a single line drive would be a clear advantage as well.
Or maybe a saber hilt similar to Erv's superb Tron disk, lighting up from inside before igniting the blade. OK, maybe I am getting carried away.

Offline TheBaconWizard

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I'm just thinking about how to do the armpit trick with 4 leads...GND and VCC are OK, but data-in and data-out must go diagonally to the next stage. But I fully trust the imagination of this community.


As a suggestion: armpit the data leads at 90deg from the V+ and V-, so you end up with leads North and South for supply and East/West for data.
Alternate which way you bend them (ie, if data-out went to compass West with V+ orientated North, then do it to East next time. So when you ladder the whole thing, your Vsupply leads are parallel, but data is serial.

Might need a little marker pen to dot all the ones that are in one orientation, and store them in a separate box.

----

I wonder if the diffusion is just media-blasted surface, or something included in the resin itself.

Offline EXAR KUN

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Or maybe a saber hilt similar to Erv's superb Tron disk, lighting up from inside before igniting the blade. OK, maybe I am getting carried away.

No I don't think you're crazy I'm working on a saber like that!



 

retrousse