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Author Topic: Padmè's death  (Read 9612 times)

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Offline Silas_Ryder

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Padmè's death
« on: January 22, 2015, 05:22:32 PM »
Padmé Didn’t Die of a Broken Heart : RetroZap!

Fantastic read on the death of Padmè and a deep meaning of the force and how it can be manipulated.

Offline ANAKIN SKYWALKER

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Re: Padmè's death
« Reply #1 on: January 22, 2015, 06:51:45 PM »
that was actually a really good read.  it always bothered me that padme's death was known to palpatine, and this actually is a pretty flawless explanation of what happened. 


Offline cvsickle

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Re: Padmè's death
« Reply #2 on: January 22, 2015, 06:57:58 PM »
This is a much better way of looking at the movie. It helps it make some semblence of sense at the end. Though, I admit that I'm having trouble trying to believe that George Lucas could plan something that intricate, especially given his track record with the prequels. I'd call it a happy accident.

Offline Modern-Day Warrior

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Re: Padmè's death
« Reply #3 on: January 22, 2015, 07:19:43 PM »
Love this interpretation. To cvsickle; what track record, exactly? Keep in mind it was Palpatine that manipulated Padme and Anakin into crossing paths again in AOTC, and he knows entirely about Anakin's anxieties of her death from the very beginning of ROTS.

Hmmm, I wonder if Palpatine was able to manipulate Anakin's visions to show him a potential death of Padme... Oh man, that totally reminds me of Satan in Paradise Lost giving Eve the dream to eat the Fruit. Literature! :D
« Last Edit: January 22, 2015, 07:24:59 PM by Modern-Day Warrior »

Offline cvsickle

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Re: Padmè's death
« Reply #4 on: January 22, 2015, 07:35:31 PM »
By track record, I mean the overall delivery of each of the prequel movies.

Phantom Menace: explosions, boring politics, unnecessary pod-racing, and a cartoon rabbit that steps in poop.

Attack of the Clones: "Love" story that makes zero sense (child hood crush creepily remains to adulthood, rather than being met by consternation, is welcomed with open arms despite the fairly major age difference and the lack of reason to have feelings for each other. It just wasn't believable); historically cautious and skeptical Jedi blindly accept a clone army that they were against the existence and use of (even when they KNOW the origins of it are sketchy. Also not believable).

Revenge of the Sith: extremely bad acting allowed into the final cut, characters invented to sell toys (Grevious, etc.), 45 minute long lightsaber fight, more bad acting.

Don't get me wrong, I legitimately enjoyed them as a star wars fan, but it seemed as though George and the team were trying less and less to make a solid movie as time went on, and simply tried to sell more and more toys.  There are some major plot holes in the prequel movies, but fans such as the writer of the article above have been able to piece some things together in some major ways.  Do I think it's possible for George to have intentionally written ROTS as described in the article? Sure.  I'm just saying that it's incredibly unlikely, and that if he had, I'd assume we'd see some more depth in the rest of the trilogy as well.

Offline jedirobe

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Re: Padmè's death
« Reply #5 on: January 22, 2015, 08:50:56 PM »
I disagree. If you really watch the films you'll see a very intricate story line. But everyone is entitled to their opinion.


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Offline Rusty

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Re: Padmè's death
« Reply #6 on: January 22, 2015, 09:36:59 PM »
The only movie i didn't really like was AOTC.  Had some good ideas but could have been much better.

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Offline COUNT DOOKU

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Re: Padmè's death
« Reply #7 on: January 22, 2015, 10:29:46 PM »
If you expound upon that concept, you could see how Palpatine wove together the entire love story itself. Which would explain why it looked so forced...

Just saying.

Chillingly Brilliant that article is, and Palpatine just gets worse and worse as a villain the further down that rabbit hole you go.

I love it.  >:D

Pass on what you have learned. Strength. Mastery. But weakness, folly, failure also. Yes, failure most of all. The greatest teacher, failure is. We are what they grow beyond. That is the true burden of all masters. ~Master Yoda~

Offline WEDGE ANTILLES

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Re: Padmè's death
« Reply #8 on: January 23, 2015, 12:03:50 AM »
I suppose it could happen.

the force is an energy field created by all living things. life sustains it, makes it grow. luminous beings, etc etc. this means: when a jedi reaches out into the force for strength, he borrows a bit of strength from 'all living things', and this allows him to move mountains. or Xwings. --> if anakin's connection to padme overruled his connection to "all living things" then I suppose that anakin would be borrowing his strength from padme. necessarily then, this would need to be the reason why Jedi are not allowed to fall in love. because when a jedi falls in love, then that person is doomed. the jedi will sap her strength, unconsciously. and if THIS is the case.. then why didn't anybody TELL anakin this when he was growing up? instead they just have this rule in place, "don't fall in love, because [SECRET]". that doesn't really make much sense. also, I think we would need to see it, in anakin's relationship to Shmi. his bond of love started with his mother and was transferred onto padme via adolescent creepiness. one would expect then, that anakin was unconsciously sapping force-energy from shmi -- the more he thrived as a jedi, the weaker she would get.. until she dies in a tusken camp. I suppose, when a mother is willing to accept slavery to give her child a better existence, then she IS giving of herself to bolster his life-as-a-Jedi. but.. c'mon. that's a bit of a stretch. I think we would need to see something more explicit to establish the link between "jedi attachment" and "draining of life-force".

I guess the scene where anakin looks out across the city scape and shares a tear with padme from her apartment balcony (right before he confronts Mace in Palpatin'e office) could be seen as establishing a link between anakin and padme -- they're like the corsican twins -- when one feels pain, then the other feels it too -- this makes him stronger and gives him the resolve to go kill windu... while padme sobs in pain. so this might (kind of) establish that they share a psychic force-bond(?), that she shares his pain, and this makes him stronger (while making her weaker)... to the point where, when anakin is in mortal danger, then he unconsciously saps the life right out of her in order to survive himself.

(I suppose it could happen).

I'm just not convinced. like I said, you'd think somebody would have told anakin as a child : a jedi can never form attachments, and here's why: it places the person in mortal danger!! Or: a jedi must be removed from his parents as an infant, and here's why: because jedi's can't have attachments! it places the parents in mortal danger!! (it just seems to me that IF this was the crux of the entire plot, then somebody would have mentioned it, somewhere, you know.. in the plot.  it's hard to imagine that the central plot of the entire thing wasn't EVEN included as a "plot point" by the author).
« Last Edit: January 23, 2015, 12:06:21 AM by WEDGE ANTILLES »
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Offline Darkjedi

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Re: Padmè's death
« Reply #9 on: January 23, 2015, 04:57:20 AM »
Very interesting. This is the connection to the " Living Force".

Ok I have not read the PT books. Is any of this explored in the books ( PT that is.) I know this is in the a few EU books.

There "we"go getting into cannon/noncannon. We don't want to go the route. I'll just stick with the eu, more things are explained.

This was a very thought out article an interesting take.

Yes I think Palpatine had something to do with her death and whole scheme of things. It all there.

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Offline XsaberX

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Re: Padmè's death
« Reply #10 on: January 23, 2015, 05:44:59 AM »
I like this writeup. It's always been clear that Sidious had a large part to play regarding Anakin and Padme. It is great to point out that Sidious was completely aware of Padme's death, even though he had no means of knowing (aside from the Force).

I find the role of Sidous regarding Anakin very interesting. Essentially Sidious and his master create Anakin (who originally wants to help others), then Sidous twists Anakin's primary value from helping (love based) to controlling/power (fear based), ultimately creating a primal fear in Anakin, flaunting a power that can relieve him of this fear (immortality of self and others), and then Sidous easily turns Anakin into his power hungry apprentice - yet ultimately, in all of this, Sidious creates his own destruction.

And of course we can say this is the will of the Force, and that Sidious was just used by the Force to bring itself into balance.

I agree that Sidious was right there at every twist and turn in Anakin's life, that he manifested those dreams of Padme dying, maybe even that he played a larger part in Anakin's mother's death (it's kind of telling that she dies seconds after seeing Anakin yet she was held captive for over a month...).

The only part of this article that I don't think is necessary is regarding the claim that Sidious took the "living force" from Padme to save Anakin. Yes, he used the force to kill Padme and keep Anakin alive - that he particularly transferred force energy from one to the other, seems silly. The Force is the primary energy of all that is, the substance of life itself - it is limitless and infinite - it's not that life creates it, it is the other way around, it is what everything is - life (a human, a rock, a star) is a manifestation of the Force. For instance, Sidious doesn't have to borrow power from other life forms to make force lightning - the force is everywhere and everything and even beyond things.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2015, 05:58:48 AM by XsaberX »

Offline Silas_Ryder

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Re: Padmè's death
« Reply #11 on: January 23, 2015, 07:04:11 AM »
The only part of this article that I don't think is necessary is regarding the claim that Sidious took the "living force" from Padme to save Anakin. Yes, he used the force to kill Padme and keep Anakin alive - that he particularly transferred force energy from one to the other, seems silly.

But in the Mortis arc in the Clone wars, Anakin used the last bit of life force from the daughter to revive Ahsoka. So I think it's possible

Offline WEDGE ANTILLES

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Re: Padmè's death
« Reply #12 on: January 23, 2015, 10:10:02 AM »
ahsoka is a jedi and is therefore connected to the force.  padme is'nt.  so any 'transfer of force energy' would have to be via the spiritual connection between anakin and padme (aka: love). so again, padme died of a broken heart.  the rest can be seen as metaphor.
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Once Vader dies, he doesn't come back to life, the Emperor doesn't get cloned, and Luke doesn't get married..."
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Offline 97th Acolyte

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Re: Padmè's death
« Reply #13 on: January 23, 2015, 11:30:18 AM »
ahsoka is a jedi and is therefore connected to the force.  padme is'nt.  so any 'transfer of force energy' would have to be via the spiritual connection between anakin and padme (aka: love). so again, padme died of a broken heart.  the rest can be seen as metaphor.

Isn't all life connected to the living force though? Hence, living force? :/

Still, article was a great read. I'd never bought the broken heart thing, but never really thought about it. :)
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Offline WEDGE ANTILLES

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Re: Padmè's death
« Reply #14 on: January 23, 2015, 01:30:13 PM »
but padme isn't 'more' connected to the living force,  compared to 'all life'....    I mean, if anakin was reaching into the force for strength, he would borrow it from 'all life' then; not from padme alone.

if we are to believe that anakin drained 'living force' from padme, thus killing her.. then this would have to be, by virtue of his connection to padme; not padme's connection to the living force -- because her connection to the living force is really just the same as everybody else -- why didn't anakin drain 'living force' from everybody else?

 
« Last Edit: January 23, 2015, 01:35:11 PM by WEDGE ANTILLES »
"The Star Wars story is really the tragedy of Darth Vader. That is the story.
Once Vader dies, he doesn't come back to life, the Emperor doesn't get cloned, and Luke doesn't get married..."
- George Lucas