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Author Topic: Introducing "Igniter" Sound and Led Drivr  (Read 102815 times)

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Offline MaleficusForte

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Re: Introducing "Igniter" Sound and Led Drivr
« Reply #30 on: March 29, 2011, 05:43:01 AM »
Awesome stuff, maybe the Igniter can rival the "Buttered Toast" sometime in the future and be called something like "Caviar" or "Maple Syrup Pancake"  or "Fried Chicken" ;D  :D  :)

Offline Onli-Won Kanomi

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Re: Introducing "Igniter" Sound and Led Drivr
« Reply #31 on: March 29, 2011, 06:39:25 AM »

...accelerometor seems the way to go, 3 axis and high G sensing  and hang the cost...

...all this said i believe that EVERYONE wishes you complete success with this project, so best of luck.

There are very definite reasons an accelerometer is NOT the way to go that have nothing to do with cost but this is a rather 'sensitive' subject here that we probably should not discuss in this thread...you might want to send a PM to LDM or others involved with the Petit Crouton development and I'm sure they could explain those 'non technical reasons' why the PC uses a ball sensor not accelerometers and why using accelerometers might be better avoided for any aspiring soundboard maker...I certainly do wish you success with this project as everyone does so wouldnt want you to choose a technology that could create 'other problems' for you down the line...probably 'nuff said' on that subject. :-\ MTFBWY
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Offline Sunrider

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Re: Introducing "Igniter" Sound and Led Drivr
« Reply #32 on: March 29, 2011, 06:57:18 AM »
 I would use the accelerometer if I were you. I think someone should challenge the notion that a certain type of component can be patented for a certain use. That's like saying I patented using a led to light a saber blade so you can't do it too.  :'(  ::)

Offline Ducos Rossis

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Re: Introducing "Igniter" Sound and Led Drivr
« Reply #33 on: March 29, 2011, 07:25:49 AM »
Looks very promising. Im just hoping it wont be like crystal focus being impossible to get, as i feel like the more wealthy people on the boards here have 5 or more CF sabers. Is that a Arduino Nano 3.0 i see there in the middle? Who were you thinking to have do final board construction? keep up the good work. I will follow this tread with great interest.



Offline IndustrialAction

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Re: Introducing "Igniter" Sound and Led Drivr
« Reply #34 on: March 29, 2011, 07:34:41 AM »
I would love to see a board that has wide availability and isn't limited to two sound fonts and two accent LEDs (amongst other issues). I'm working with PC-Ls in my builds because it is the best quality board that I can get my hands on. If there were CFs on the market, I'd buy a bunch of them but there aren't. I understand why there aren't but that doesn't make me wish I had one (or more) any less.

I'm glad to see others stepping up and working on designs. I think the saber building community at large shares that sentiment. I don't want to buy a pre-built saber, I want to build my own and I have a strong desire to have more freedom than the PC-L has to offer.

Offline ANAKIN SKYWALKER

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Re: Introducing "Igniter" Sound and Led Drivr
« Reply #35 on: March 29, 2011, 08:31:35 AM »
definately go with an accelerometer. 
I would love to see a board that has wide availability and isn't limited to two sound fonts and two accent LEDs (amongst other issues). I'm working with PC-Ls in my builds because it is the best quality board that I can get my hands on. If there were CFs on the market, I'd buy a bunch of them but there aren't. I understand why there aren't but that doesn't make me wish I had one (or more) any less.

I'm glad to see others stepping up and working on designs. I think the saber building community at large shares that sentiment. I don't want to buy a pre-built saber, I want to build my own and I have a strong desire to have more freedom than the PC-L has to offer.

Nuff said


Offline Rogue Graymatter

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Re: Introducing "Igniter" Sound and Led Drivr
« Reply #36 on: March 29, 2011, 08:49:19 AM »
It's already better than a US, breadboard and all. At least it doesn't clash right when you turn it on. ;D Keep it going!
RG

Offline Snake-Eyes

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Re: Introducing "Igniter" Sound and Led Drivr
« Reply #37 on: March 29, 2011, 09:45:16 AM »
Great stuff, man!   :o

My 2-cents: if you haven't already, start a dialogue with Erv & LDM/Grievous.  Why reinvent the wheel and learn the same difficult lessons the hard way, instead if via one-to-one dialogue between colleagues?

The smiths and manufacturers here are Extraordinarily willing to help those who genuinely want to advance the hobby.  Be grateful and respectful.  I think you will find them receptive to help.

Innovation/creativity should be encouraged... If someone wants to challenge your ideas/design, let them.
You seem to be enjoying your self-proclaimed "tinkering";  good on ya...   ;)



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Offline xl97

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Re: Introducing "Igniter" Sound and Led Drivr
« Reply #38 on: March 29, 2011, 09:57:25 AM »
looks good!..

(now to prototype it all on a small footprint PCB.) =)


your 'tru mixing' is nice..

its the same as the RFX platform.. 2 channels

(you can have the constant background sound (hum).. and  play any other sound files over that one.)

what micro-controller is it based off?

Did you start from scratch with a PIC or ATMEL..or use a jump-point platform..like an Arduino or something?


also (I dont recall seeing (sorry) )are you using senors? or any sort of accelerometer? or are effects only triggered by button press?
thanks.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2011, 04:14:24 PM by xl97 »

Offline Kalizon

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Re: Introducing "Igniter" Sound and Led Drivr
« Reply #39 on: March 29, 2011, 10:52:41 AM »
Good start.  Many things to work out you have, but possibilities this project has.

+1

Look forward to seeing more. (Add me as interested.)
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Offline naigon

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Re: Introducing "Igniter" Sound and Led Drivr
« Reply #40 on: March 29, 2011, 12:25:56 PM »
I too would like to know the intended target min/max voltage input and output ranges and maximum current out but so far...intriguingly promising.

MTFBWY as you continue development.

Thanks for the interest, these are the kinds of details we need to get flushed out now.

Right now the audio amp does require an absolute minimum of 5v to run well and doesn't really sound good until 6, so your chances of using a single 3.7v li-ion are probably out the window.

Maximum is somewhat open right now as it really depends on the final 3.3v regulator I choose, but I would expect the ability to go up to 12v (all components besides the microcontroller can take more than this even). Just remember that the higher voltage you use compared to voltage required will make more heat, so you would probably run into some serious cooling issues at anything above 9v-ish.

Hope this helps.
Naigon
Igniter developer/creater - my site is in my profile!
http://www.fx-sabers.com/forum/index.php?topic=29490.0

Offline naigon

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Re: Introducing "Igniter" Sound and Led Drivr
« Reply #41 on: March 29, 2011, 12:46:19 PM »
Very impressive.  You asked for suggestions / what we'd like to see, so I have a couple things to I'd like to mention that have been on my mind.

1.  Configurable sound interrupt parameters

In regards to blaster block and lockup, I'd like to have not just the wavs configurable, but ideally their behavior.  That would include adjusting flicker effects (which the Ultrasound, and to a greater extent the PC and Crystal Focus currently allow for), but also the ability to choose whether or not they can be interrupted by other sounds, like clashes and swings.  Keep in mind that for maximum openness, not all users will necessarily use the blaster block / lockup slots strictly for blaster block / lockup effects.  Or they just may or may not want their blaster block effects, for example, to be able to be interrupted by clash and / or swing effects for matters of personal taste.  Or they may just want to ditch the blaster block and have two different kinds of lockup effects available on the fly for variety's sake.  I don't know about the Crystal Focus, but to the best of my knowledge the Ultrasound, PC, and MR boards do not allow you to adjust which sound effect can interrupt which.  Instead, they are set at what are generally very sensible, logical choices:  blaster blocks can be interrupted by clashes but not swings, lockup can't be interrupted by anything.  But personally, I'd rather have two totally open, configurable sound files whose interrupt parameters are totally configurable, rather than two which are optimized to serve as straight blaster blocks / lockup.  

2.  Unwanted swing sfx activation control

The other issue I wanted to address is the problem of activating unwanted swings, which you get when using the rolling ball swing detectors used on MR and PC boards.  If you plan to go with an accelerometer, like the CF or the Ultrasound, this problem is pretty much solved for you.  But if you will be using the rolling ball setup (which will, on the positive side, allow you to control price a bit), then I have a suggestion.  I'd like to see momentary swing deactivation available on your soundboard, such that the user could depress a button on their hilt which will make swings impossible to activate while held down.

Why?  So that when you are just standing there, or walking slowly with the hilt held in front of you, you don't hear the hilt go "whoosh - whoosh - vim - slash - whoosh!" just because you breathed or turned to look at your brother.  There are many great moments in the films where there is a break in the fighting and the two opponents are squaring off, measuring each other, pacing slowly, etc., and all you hear is the quiet hum of their blades.  That's hard to achieve currently with MR and PC boards.  

There are two ways you could implement this.  One would be to have an additional sound slot configured (or better, configurable to be) like a lockup, featuring a duplicate hum wave.  When depressed, this would produce a hum sound that could not be interrupted by a swing or clash.  (In fact, if you commission a PC board from a smith, you should be able to do this now (not on the TCSS ones) by substituting a hum wav for your lockup.  It's just that you'd lose the lockup.)

An even simpler solution, as I was advised recently, would be to just put in a momentary / latching switch that opened the circuit of the swing detector, effectively deactivating it for as long as the button was depressed.  A very easy solution, and one that could potentially be applied to any sound board with metal ball swing detection (although not without monkeying with the board and thus invalidating your warranty if you're working with a PC).  

When the swing is fully active, of course, this solution still won't give it the precision swing registration of a CF or Ultrasound.  But this workaround would get rid of the most annoying problem, the activation of a flurry of battle action sounds when you're just standing there doing nothing.  Again, this fix would likely work on any metal ball swing detection sound board, but since you're still in the formative stages, you could integrate it more elegantly if you were so inclined.  

Anyhow, that's my two cents.  Best of luck with your new board.  I'm definitely interested in seeing your progress.

Great suggestions! Here are my answers:

1. I think some configuration could be done here so that clashes had the choice to be over-rideen or not say, but for some key things (when in blaster block mode a clash should override it and exit the mode) would not be configurable.

I'll spend some more time looking at the main detection loop and think about how I could incorporate this, but its a great idea as you could set up different fonts for different purposes (IE one font with clash overriding everything as a dueling font, one with blaster block overriding as your "show" font, ect). I'll put it in my notebook and think it over.

2. Great idea, but the only issue is that another switch would be required; but you could say turn the functionality of the aux hold to not have lockup and do this instead only for fonts with this config specified. I'd definitely be interested to get other's opinions on this as I would choose to solve this by setting the sensitivity really high for a font that would mostly be standing still and one really sensitive for one that I would swing around a lot.

As for the accelerometer, as perfect as it would be I'm very hesitant to use it mainly due to the price. Most good ones that would interface with the micro-controller well are like 30 USD apiece, so that would really drive the price up. I'm currently thinking of trying 3 swing sensors in an X, Y, Z pattern to be able to get motion from each direction and have the ability to filter out unwanted triggering. I think the biggest problem with the swing sensor is that it really only gives good info in one direction, so using three with the correct filtering may work well.

But if everyone wants to pay a much huger price an accelerometer would be an okay choice too; I'd definitely like to hear some opinions on that.
Naigon
Igniter developer/creater - my site is in my profile!
http://www.fx-sabers.com/forum/index.php?topic=29490.0

Offline ANAKIN SKYWALKER

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Re: Introducing "Igniter" Sound and Led Drivr
« Reply #42 on: March 29, 2011, 12:49:48 PM »
I don't think we would care about the price increase.  Fellas feel free to agree with me


Offline GENERAL GRIEVOUS

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Re: Introducing "Igniter" Sound and Led Drivr
« Reply #43 on: March 29, 2011, 12:51:53 PM »
I don't think we would care about the price increase.  Fellas feel free to agree with me

There is one very loud person who will care a LOT.  Trust me, an accelerometer is a BAD idea.  Don't you all think there is a very good reason that the PC doesn't use one? ::)

Offline Rezolution

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Re: Introducing "Igniter" Sound and Led Drivr
« Reply #44 on: March 29, 2011, 01:00:14 PM »
The only reason I haven't purchased a PC-L is because it doesn't have an accelerometer.  If it had and accelerometer instead of the ball bearing switches, I would have bought 4 of them.

I hope you decide to have the accelerometer or a way to add it on for people that want to pay the extra money, perhaps as an add on with molex connector or something.

 

retrousse