Clone Wars continuity error???

[BOBA FETT]

I would think he was content with Vader UNTIL he saw Luke.

I have yet to accept the Force Unleashed story line as true-canon.

[The Apprentice]

I would think he was content with Vader UNTIL he saw Luke.

I have yet to accept the Force Unleashed story line as true-canon.

I'm glad you said that Sifo. I kow that the fan base can be quite divided on this issue, but I like to think that Sidious and Vader have a special bond. Afterall, Palpatine spent a lot of time and effort grooming Anakin to become Vader and to suddenly turn cold on him and view him as just a henchman doesn't sit right with me. Of course, it all changes when Luke comes along...

As for TFU, I like the whole "birth of the rebellion" story and take that as canon but I also view Starkiller's force powers to be a story telling device rather than fact. That way I can take the parts I like and convieniently ignore the bits I don't!

[Onli-Won Kanomi]

I think he was content with Vader until he saw Luke too.

That doesnt mean Vader was content with him and that is where Starkiller comes in and I have no problem reconciling TFU with the OT...since Vader believed his child [singular] was dead with Padme as a result of everything that happened since he became a Sith its not surprising he would take a secret apprentice and plot revenge on Palpatine... if he'd known about either Luke and/or Leia surviving he'd have probably taken them for secret apprentice(s) but didn't so he took Galen Marek instead.

The Emperor was quite happy with Vader as his not secret apprentice; the deliberate 'hobbling' of Vader with the bad Vader suit instead of a more efficient Grevious type meant that Vader would remain, if not loyal, handicapped from making any direct attempt to usurp Sidious...it was only because he saw an opportunity to play Luke and Vader off against each other and destroy the last trace two Jedi in the process that he manipulated them in ESB and ROTJ

[The Apprentice]

I'm not sure that Vader's desire to overthrow his master stems from his anger or hate, rather than simple Sithly scheming. If the latter is true, I'm sure Sidious would be very proud!

Anyhow, we are straying far off-topic (my fault, I'm sorry). This could do with a separate thread if anyone wishes to discuss the Palpatine/Vader relationship with me.

[Orakaa]

In layman's terms... Lucas can't keep his own universe straight 

So sad... but SOOO true...

[Avvatar]

I know we HAVE strayed far off topic, and if this needs to be moved to a new one so be it and i appologize but...

I agree that the Emperor was Content with Vader until Luke showed up. Much like he was content manipulating the Count untill the soon to be more powerful ani was 'ready'.  I always saw Sidious as "in a constant state of looking for the next toy".

One thing hasnt sat right with me on the whole "TFU plot line".  I always believed that Sidious learned the power to keep someone from dying from his master and then killed him. Only later to use that power on Vader. The cyborg Vader suit , IMO , was keeping him somewhat stable. But his master's sheer will is what allowed him to survive.  The second he threw the emperor over the railing and killed him, the will was gone, and only the bio suits abilities remained. Hence why he started to sound like General Grev. and rasp more and die. 

I could be way off here, but it was my observation/belief.  and going by that i wondered why the heck would Vader want Starkiller to take down Sidious.  That would mean Vaders demise aswell.

Just i thought.

Also, Vader had his stubby limbs still. as i recall ( and correct me if im wrong) only his arms and legs from the knees/elbows on where cyborg. I thought Grevious only had like, a few organs left?  i dont Grevous' cyborg body as being more well constructed then the 'Vader Suit".  I dont (IMO) think the suit "hobbled" him and is what made him move stiff in fights, i thought it might be that he was an old man now...

[Orakaa]

I know we HAVE strayed far off topic, and if this needs to be moved to a new one so be it but...

One thing hasnt sat right with me on the whole "TFU plot line".  I always believed that Sidious learned the power to keep someone from dying from his master and then killed him. Only later to use that power on Vader. The cyborg Vader suit , IMO , was keeping him somewhat stable. But his masters sheer will is what allowed him to survive.  The second he threw the emporer over the railing and killed him, the will was gone, and only the bio suits abilities remained. Hence why he started to sound like General Grev. and rasp more and die. 

I could be way off here, but it was my observation/belief.  and going by that i wondered why the heck would Vader want Starkiller to take down Sidious.  That would mean Vaders demise aswell.

Just i thought.

This is a VERY interesting viewpoint... Never saw this like that (and I like this viewpoint)... but when I think of it there is one thing that doesn't make sense : remember how Vader ask his son to join him and that together they could beat the Emperor in ESB ?

Yet, despite that fact, it would make MORE sense to go in your interpretation (it would explains a little bit more Vader's enslavement to Palpatine : after all, he knows that Palpy used him)

[Avvatar]

This is a VERY interesting viewpoint... Never saw this like that (and I like this viewpoint)... but when I think of it there is one thing that doesn't make sense : remember how Vader ask his son to join him and that together they could beat the Emperor in ESB ?

Yet, despite that fact, it would make MORE sense to go in your interpretation (it would explains a little bit more Vader's enslavement to Palpatine : after all, he knows that Palpy used him)

Hmmmm good point.  I suppose you could say, "well, maybe Vader had no idea the emperor we helping him stay alive with some Sith Force link". Or maybe that he had hopes that Luke would join them, and that someday Vader would learn the power and Luke and he could use it to keep Vader alive, cutting out the middle man lol. but alas maybe im reaching too much. 

[Orakaa]

No, but it's interesting to see how Vader doesn't agree to join with Luke in ROTJ when he's CLOSE to the emperor.
Maybe instead of a life support, the Emperor has gained some sort of "control" over Vader by reviving him... and that this "link" is stronger as the Emperor is closer to Vader.

That could explain as well how Vader "killed" Starkiller so quickly, without second thought on the Emperor's order when he was right next to him.

[KI-ADI-MUNDI]

You guys need to read Dark Lord...it's the book that came out right after ROTS....It's about Vader and it explains alot of what your talking about here....He felt that Palpatine hobbled him with that imperfect suit...also after the nightmare on Mustafar and the whole process of being put in the suit he starts to lose touch with his life as Anakin the way it was...it all starts to feel like a dream to him...Vaders true identity is a secret to those around him which also plays into his reliance on Palpatine... also after Anakin's defeat on Mustafar he is simply not as strong in the force as he was...And as far as secret apprentice's....the Emperor's right hand...Mara Jade....it's the Sith nature to always be looking for someone to replace the one their with regardless of the situation....

[Master Durangus]

I know we HAVE strayed far off topic, and if this needs to be moved to a new one so be it and i appologize but...

I agree that the Emperor was Content with Vader until Luke showed up. Much like he was content manipulating the Count untill the soon to be more powerful ani was 'ready'.  I always saw Sidious as "in a constant state of looking for the next toy".

One thing hasnt sat right with me on the whole "TFU plot line".  I always believed that Sidious learned the power to keep someone from dying from his master and then killed him. Only later to use that power on Vader. The cyborg Vader suit , IMO , was keeping him somewhat stable. But his master's sheer will is what allowed him to survive.  The second he threw the emperor over the railing and killed him, the will was gone, and only the bio suits abilities remained. Hence why he started to sound like General Grev. and rasp more and die. 

I could be way off here, but it was my observation/belief.  and going by that i wondered why the heck would Vader want Starkiller to take down Sidious.  That would mean Vaders demise aswell.

Just i thought.

Also, Vader had his stubby limbs still. as i recall ( and correct me if im wrong) only his arms and legs from the knees/elbows on where cyborg. I thought Grevious only had like, a few organs left?  i dont Grevous' cyborg body as being more well constructed then the 'Vader Suit".  I dont (IMO) think the suit "hobbled" him and is what made him move stiff in fights, i thought it might be that he was an old man now...

While you have an interesting point, all the books I've read point to something different  . Vader did not need Sidious to live. According to "The Rise of Darth Vader," and several other books, Vader was only alive because of his Dark Side mastery. It was also mentioned by Lucas, in the books (or you can check the Wookiepedia article) that Darth Vader died because Sidious' lightning fried his bio-suit. So while it's an interesting theory, the books seem to directly say otherwise...from what I've read, Darth Vader used his own power to sustain his life and his suit was fried by the lightning, unable to sustain him. Interesting theory though!